Post by patrappernewbie on Feb 4, 2014 16:20:53 GMT -5
Hello All, I have a very serious question. I'm going to college next year, and I've always wanted to farm for a living, but never thought it plausible. Until recently, that is, when I found out that there is a lot of farm/land elsewhere from where I live (in other states) relatively cheap. I was wondering if anybody has any advice, who do it for a living themselves? I would help offset cost by writing, I plan to major in creative writing. Any advice is dearly welcomed. Thank you.
My advice to anyone that wants to do anything. Get a job in that field, they pay you while they teach you all the ins and out of the business. Ask questions, be observant and absorb all you can from the experience. Then take all the money you saved in school loans and start your own business.
If you want to farm, a college degree in creative writing is not necessary nor prudent.
Make some phone calls and tour some farms. Do some unpaid internships (might as well get used to the "unpaid" part if you are farming ) See what kind of farming suits you. Livestock? Row cropping? other?
Get a paid job working for a couple farms doing the things that interest you for a couple years. Pay your dues with hard work instead of giant student loans. You will also be LEARNING from people who actually are DOING what you want to do.
Take creative writing classes at night at the local community college to keep that pot simmering. Learn about real estate and land issues. Maybe buy a couple acres with a SMALL loan and try to make a go of some venture, then sell it for a profit. Take small business classes at the community college then start and run a small business.
Its all about LEARNING without digging a hole that will take years to get out of. My college degrees did little to prepare me for the reality of working in my field. I was skilled and proficient at my trade but had NO IDEA what all went into running a business on a daily basis.
Colleges are great at SELLING YOU an "education". Most are terrible at teaching you how to succeed at business. No matter what you are going to do for a living, from being an employee flipping burgers with a paper hat, to running a giant corporation, to working on or owning a farm...YOU ARE RUNNING A BUSINESS !
2014-15 Trapping Season
1 bobcat
6 coons
2 yote
21 grinner
1 beaver
14 mice
2 Stinker
I hope my suggestions didn't come across as discouraging.
You are probably young and have the luxury of time. Use that to your advantage. Give yourself a year or three to TRY some of the things you want to do BEFORE going for a big money college degree. LEARN from people DOING what you want to do. They know what works NOW in TODAYs world.
Get a little experience in several fields that interest you and file that away. Most people change careers 4 times in the first 10 years of their working life. Then 2-3 more times in the back half.
College is excellent if you are training for a highly technical profession where that knowledge is only available through a university. Most employers are more concerned with your work history and experience. In this job market, a degree just lumps you in with 10,000 other people who graduated with that degree last semester looking for work. The guy with EXPERIENCE has a jump on everybody else. He already KNOWS how to do something productive.
Ahhh to be young and energetic again with my whole life ahead of me....
Enjoy your big adventure out in the "real world".
2014-15 Trapping Season
1 bobcat
6 coons
2 yote
21 grinner
1 beaver
14 mice
2 Stinker
Post by nytrapper23 on Feb 5, 2014 18:58:46 GMT -5
Agree 100% with the last three statements. . I will give you an excellent example . My daughter has said since kindergarten that she wanted to be a teacher.well she never wavered on this , so when she was a junior we did the college tours , can't become a teacher without the degree and a masters. We went to several schools , it was the same thing over and over,until we got to a state school and that person told my daughter if you want to become a teacher AND GET a job when your finished, you have to make your self different from everyone else. If you just do the education , when you get out of school you will be the same as thousands of others looking for a teaching job. So she took several extra classes and certifications , little more work , but she was hired at a local school before she even left school,many she went thru school with are still just temps or subs. The reason I'm saying this is . 1. A degree is great but Is it one that is useful? 2. Don't go to school just to go to school,have a plan. 3. If you are young , you might want to try some other things , do night school , find a niche , then jump in ,before starting a family. Just my two cents hope it helps a little.
Post by patrappernewbie on Feb 5, 2014 19:24:45 GMT -5
Thanks for the advise, sorry I should have made some clarifications. I currently have a summer job at a research farm facility (but its not the kind of farming I want to get into). I'm good friends with an older farmer, and I used to bale hay for him. I also can go to a university tuiton free due to my mom having a job there. I plan on writing regardless, but I would like to get into farming. I plan on switching jobs this summer to a legit farm, as opposed to the research one I work on now.
Totally agree with all of the above. Whenever I hear someone say they are going to college, I have to bite my lip and NOT say what I think about that. If they want a job that requires a degree then fine, but I know lots of folks that dream of a simple life, Carefree cabin living, spending days in the woods etc etc and their excuse why they CAN'T have that is cause they owe too many school loans on BS that they couldn't find a job for. Man I could go on and on but I won't.
Post by patrappernewbie on Feb 5, 2014 19:26:23 GMT -5
Plus at this college, I would minor in business. If I still desire to go into agriculture, I can go to a separate university to get an education in that realm (if necessary).
I agree with everyones comments above.I farm ( corn soybeans alafala and have stock cows ) and I love my job but it is a lot of work and at times a big gamble. It is a very hard field to get into depending on what type of farming you plan to get into. Besides land equipment is also expensive so is upkeep it helps to be able to do repair yourself you have to be a jack of all trades . If you like to hunt trap and fish you will miss some of the best times to do these things cause you will be planting harvesting fixing fence or a thousand other things that have to be done.
It also takes a very understanding family crops and livestock don't no what weekends are there are many times during planting and harvest I put in 18 hour days .
I'm not trying to deter you from becoming a farmer but its not always as fun nor easy as it may seem but I wouldn't want to do anything else.
Get some hands on experience take some classes at a tech school there are many good ag classes depending on what type of farming you plan to do but you need to get a job working for a farmer it will be the best education you will get .
Patrapper if your looking for a farming job try putting an ad in craiglist in the farm and garden section .
If you want you can come help me in April I've got a lot of rock to pick and tons of s**t to haul before I can plant always looking for help with those projects just can't find anyone to do them but me.
Post by patrappernewbie on Feb 6, 2014 15:50:55 GMT -5
JC, I do want that kind of lifestyle, and my parents do support me, but they want me to have an education jic that doesn't work lol. And mncooner, unfortunately I have school in April. Lol
Post by patrappernewbie on Feb 6, 2014 17:06:26 GMT -5
And trust me, I know that farming is not for the light hearted, and can be quite difficult. Though I haven't yet worked a steady job on a livestock farm, I've worked hard on the research farm I am employed on. Hand pollinating corn in tyvec suits for 10 hours a day the first week of August wasn't fun, lol. Farming is something I want to get into though, and keep the advice coming, it really is helpful. Thanks
Post by trappingtime0 on Feb 28, 2014 12:10:13 GMT -5
all i can say is be motivated. It is hard work and you have to work year round. also what type of farming are you wanting to do?livestock poultry vegetables? and you wont make lots of money you can live off it but you wont enjoy a giant flat screen next to the hottub but its a fun way to live and i love it but you just have to be motivated and be able to fix things when not if, when they break because they will.
You remind me of myself....thirty plus years ago. I went to Penn State University and studied agriculture. Trouble was I didn't come from a farm so I had this idealistic view of getting my hands dirty (selectively), working around animals (when I wanted to) and riding a tractor in the field (just for kicks).
In other words, I was too naive to know how much hard work and sacrifice it was going to be. It didn't take me long to figure out that I was never going to own a farm by getting a degree from college. Fact is, the small farmer is up against it in many ways. I salute you if you tough it out but I had to admit that if I was going to own anything resembling a homestead, I was going to have to work for it and save my butt off.
I ended up with a degree in resource management which I didn't need for my later career in law enforcement. Not saying college was a waste.... just saying for those that are graduating with an average of $25,000 of debt......it is getting to be a real rip. The fact that you can attend for free, that's great. Just remember when you get out...very few things will be free and if you got one penny left in your pocket, someone's going to try to get it.
Living on a small homestead with poultry, a cow, rabbits, a bee hive and a few fields to tend.....maybe you specialize in organic this or that. IMO that's the way to go. I don't see the big farm as the answer. Just my opinion from where I sit.
Post by patrappernewbie on Mar 2, 2014 13:55:38 GMT -5
Thank you for all the replies. I do want to work in organic food, much like Joel Salatin, not to that degree though. I do not plan to farm right out of school, I know it takes money to start, which is why I will be getting a job first.
You might want to look into first time farmer loans I don't know if they still have them.I got mine through FHA years ago. Sometimes there are also grants available I got some money for fencing supplies for a university rotational grazing study. The beef industry is very good right now if you can get in with a local butcher on drug free beef there is a premium for that I do it with about ten of my steers every year. Is there much pasture available in your area to buy or rent?
Is there much pasture available in your area to buy or rent?
Biofuel land leases have decreased the availability of small farmers to get land for food production.
You might want to get into biomass production with something like switchgrass. The advantages to this are that governments favor biomass producers with tax credits, research money, low interest loans and other incentives. It doesn't matter whether you believe in climate change or not - the government does.
Biomass production is trendy and isn't going to reduce our dependence on fossil fuels, ethanol mixed with gasoline is ruining our combustion engines, methane is a byproduct - and not a good one, it takes alot of land to produce alot of biomass fuel to run alot of cars and trucks and that land isn't being used to produce food to feed hungry people. So our food crops get engineered genetically to maximize production on less available acres.
Just some food for thought on the whole leasing of property thing.
Post by patrappernewbie on Mar 5, 2014 17:32:04 GMT -5
For the whole leasing land....Joel Salatin explains a very interesting method for increasing profit through leasing land. I plan to intern with him if accepted during my one of my years in college. There is not a lot of land around here, but I plan to move away from the area.
In 1958 a guy named J.I. Rodale and a few others compiled a comprehensive book on organic gardening full of practical information covering every topic relative to the relationship between soils and farming. It was called "The Encyclopedia of Organic Gardening". I have the 1978 revised edition as well as "Stocking Up"; a reference manual for proper storage of naturally grown foods.
I believe Joel Salatin was inspired by pioneers like Rodale. At the time, the mainstream farming academics, government channels of education and science shunned guys like Rodale.
Salatin said,
"We think there is strength in decentralization and spreading out rather than in being concentrated and centralized."
I think you are going to learn alot from this guy !
The thing that impresses me most about Joel Salatin is that he is a heck of a business man.
If you listen to his talks with that in mind, you begin to realize that he focuses on squeezing every penny that goes out, and maximizing every dollar coming in.
His business has so many levels to minimize costs and maximize profits. THAT is probably the only way a small farmer is going to do well these days.
From free interns doing the grunt work, to chickens and pigs spreading manure, to niche marketing his products to yuppies for top dollar, to speaking tours and teaching, he really examines every facet of his farming business and figures out how to make a buck on each.
2014-15 Trapping Season
1 bobcat
6 coons
2 yote
21 grinner
1 beaver
14 mice
2 Stinker
...to niche marketing his products to yuppies for top dollar,...
I second THIS....if you are a small farmer you have to pay attention to geopolitical trends. Find the wealthy, the uber rich, the filthy rich in your territory. Market to them.
The poor can't afford your product - they will shop at the big box stores because they have to. The middle class is pretty much filling up the ranks of the poor and many of them will be growing their own on homestead suburban properties.
Wealthy people have always defined themselves in terms of their ability to have things most others can't have. And the small farmer can provide that. Never under estimate the power of fear and greed.
Don't park the income somewhere when you get it. Inflation will eat up your buying power. Turn it into a physical asset as soon as possible. Invest it back into your operation. In my neck of the woods, the Amish are an interesting model to study when it comes to business savvy.
Post by patrappernewbie on Mar 8, 2014 12:32:45 GMT -5
I never plan on being nearly as big business as Salatin. He made $2 million last year. I just plan to intern and model after him. I've watched his talks and demos, it's really interesting the way he does his farming, the rotational grazing and such.